If Islam does not need reform, ...
.
* ... why we do not have Slaves that are permitted in Islam?
* ... why are we not telling Non Moslim Countries to convert to Islam or pay us Protection Money and since they are doing neither, why are we not attacking those countries, looting the Defeated Nations to get Allah's Booty or Maalay GhanimaT and enslaving their people like Allah had told us in Qoraan?
* ... why we don't keep believing (against what Science says) that we are born out of Blood Clot as mentioned Allah told us in Qoraan?
* ... why we do not believe Earth is on standstill and Sky is like a Roof as Allah said in Qoraan that He is holding them with His Hands?
* ... why don't we believe Planets circle around Earth as Qoraan tells us?
.
You want me to keep going with this list, illiterate Imbecile Mollaa believing in stuff that God could have never said and is a Human 'Add On' Fabrication in Qoraan ...!
----------
--- In chottala@yahoogroups.com, bristi ahmed <bristyahmad@...> wrote:
>
> Exactly! our deen (Islam) doesn't need any reform, we need to understand our guidance.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "huahmed@..." <huahmed@...>
> To: Khabor <khabor@yahoogroups.com>; World_Today@yahoogroups.com
> Cc: WorldMuslimCongress@yahoogroups.com; worldsindhinet@yahoogroups.com; American_Muslims_Today@yahoogroups.com; Canadian_Muslims@...; insaaniyatlist@yahoogroups.com; Outclass@yahoogroups.com; Humane-Rights-Agenda@yahoogroups.com; U-S-A@yahoogroups.com; LIBERTY-AND-JUSTICE@yahoogroups.com; metaphysics-100@yahoogroups.com; globalobserver@yahoogroups.com; Afghanistan_Today@yahoogroups.com; cpp <communistpartyofpakistan@yahoogroups.com>; rawalpindi2@yahoogroups.com; Z <pakistan-zindabad@yahoogroups.com>; lahore_lahore_hai@yahoogroups.com; kool-karachi@yahoogroups.com; Islamic_World_Today@yahoogroups.com; Balochistan_National_Movement@egroups.com; balochistan@yahoogroups.com; PWAP@yahoogroups.com; C C <calcutta@yahoogroups.com>; "awamileague@yahoogroups.com" <awamileague@yahoogroups.com>; "tritiomatra@yahoogroups.com" <tritiomatra@yahoogroups.com>; alo c <alochona@yahoogroups.com>; Chottala <chottala@yahoogroups.com>; "bogra@yahoogroups.com"
> <bogra@yahoogroups.com>; Dalim vi <dalim.khandaker@...>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 4, 2012 6:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [KHABOR] Islam needs reform
>
>
> Â
> Dear Mr. Turkman:
>
> May peace and security be with you. Our deen (Islam) doesn't need any reform instead, we Muslims need to understand our divine guidance.
>
> We Muslims make our deen full of religious rituals and failed to understand the true message of Quranic guidance.
>
> Thank you and have a wonderful day.
> Helal
> Sent on the TELUS Mobility network with BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: S Turkman <turkman@...>
> Sender: khabor@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 09:35:02
> To: <World_Today@yahoogroups.com>
> Reply-To: khabor@yahoogroups.com
> Cc: <WorldMuslimCongress@yahoogroups.com>; <worldsindhinet@yahoogroups.com>; <American_Muslims_Today@yahoogroups.com>; <Canadian_Muslims@...>; <insaaniyatlist@yahoogroups.com>; <Outclass@yahoogroups.com>; <Humane-Rights-Agenda@yahoogroups.com>; <U-S-A@yahoogroups.com>; <LIBERTY-AND-JUSTICE@yahoogroups.com>; <metaphysics-100@yahoogroups.com>; <globalobserver@yahoogroups.com>; <Afghanistan_Today@yahoogroups.com>; cpp<communistpartyofpakistan@yahoogroups.com>; <rawalpindi2@yahoogroups.com>; Z<pakistan-zindabad@yahoogroups.com>; <lahore_lahore_hai@yahoogroups.com>; <kool-karachi@yahoogroups.com>; <Islamic_World_Today@yahoogroups.com>; <Balochistan_National_Movement@egroups.com>; <balochistan@yahoogroups.com>; <PWAP@yahoogroups.com>; C C<calcutta@yahoogroups.com>; <awamileague@yahoogroups.com>; <khabor@yahoogroups.com>; t t<tritiomatra@yahoogroups.com>; alo c<alochona@yahoogroups.com>; <chottala@yahoogroups.com>; <bogra@yahoogroups.com>;
> <pakistan-zindabad@yahoogroups.com>; <lahore_lahore_hai@yahoogroups.com>; <rawalpindi2@yahoogroups.com>; <Balochistan_National_Movement@egroups.com>; di a<Diagnose@yahoogroups.com>; <balochistan@yahoogroups.com>; <awamileague@yahoogroups.com>; <bogra@yahoogroups.com>; <chottala@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [KHABOR] Islam needs reform
>
> Jazoo is correct and Islam needs reform because if Islam was complete in days of
> Prophet, ...
> .
> * ... why its impossible to follow Timings of Nmaaz in countries too far north?
> * ... why we can not have same date by Islamic Calendar all over the world in
> this 21st Century advanced world?
>
> * ... why Islam does not explain, what to do in Inflationary Economy of Paper
> Currency about 'Riba'?
> * ... why Islam says, Moslims can not live amongst Non Moslims?
> * ... why Islam says, we must collect Protection Money from Non Moslims in our
> countries and make Non Moslim Countries to pay or attack them?
> * ... why in this 21st century civilized world Islam permits looting of
> Defeated Nations and calls that Looting, Booty or 'Mallay GhanimaT' like we did
> in backwards Savage 7th Century world?
> * ... why Islam tells us to enslave people of Defeated Nations like we used to
> in Savage 7th Century world?
> * ... why Islam declares Slavery legal like it was a custom in Savage 7th
> Century world?
> * ... why Islam says, "Christian and Jews can not be your friends", like we
> were living in days of the Prophet, when its impossible that some people may
> remain our Enemies forever?
> .
> If we believe in 7th Century Islam, ...
> .
> * ... we can not have Paper Money and Money in all Moslim Countries is supposed
> to be Gold and Silver Coins.
>
> * ... our countries can not accept any Aid or Loans from Non Moslim Countries or
> IMF or World Bank for their Monitory survival.
>
> * ... no Moslim can live in a Non Moslim Country permanently and raise his
> children because according to Islam, we can be in a Non Moslim Country only
> temporarily for Preaching Islam, Education, Ambassadorial Duty or Business
> only.
>
> * ... 1/5th of Moslims in this world live in Non Moslim Countries. Where should
> they go? (Ref: Population of 44 Moslim Countries 1.2 billion. Total Population
> 1.5)
> * ... which Moslim Country is ready to accept 149 million Moslims in India (of
> which 52% are Shiyah), when in 1997 Pakistan did not issue even Tourist Visa to
> even Great Grand Daughter of Moslim Hero Tipu Sultan so, she could go to
> wedding of her only grand-daughter in Pakistan because she spoke Urdu and
> wanted to go to Karachi? (Ref: 1. Daily Amn, Karachi about Tipu Sultan news. 2.
> India Population 1.18 billion. Moslims 12.26%. Sunnis 8.06%. Shiyah 4.2%.
> Census Bureau India)
>
> * ... which Moslim Country is ready to accept 79 million African Black Moslims
> of Nigeria and other 72 million Moslims living in Non Moslim Countries? (Ref:
> Moslims in India and Nigeria 149 + 79 = 228 million. Moslims in Non Moslim
> Countries 300 million. Moslims in rest of Non Moslim Countries 300 - 228 = 72
> million)
> .
> With so many flaws in Islam that was completed in 633 A.D. how can we say,
> nothing can be changed and no reform is needed?
> Are we Ommah of Imbeciles only?
>
> S U Turkman
>
> ________________________________
> From: jazoo <jazoo52000@...>
>
>
> I do believe that GOD revealed the way (deen) to us (the mankind) and it
> is one in the name ISLAM (in Arabic).
>
>
> Its a daring statement
>
> God revealed Deen to Mohammad(saw)....not to us.
> Mohammad(saw) delivered Deen to us through His explanations as directed by
> Quran.
>
> We have no means to know "Deliver whats has been revealed to you(5:67)"
> We have no means to know "This Day I have perfected your Deen(5:3)
>
> What was so special delivered to Mohammad(saw)...he was strongly advised not to
> delay...or he had not done any job of Risalat.
> What happened that "This Day" when deen was completed.
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Prathiba Sundaram <prathibasam@...>
>
>
> Dear Zina, Coold down and be calm. I have read your mail, from top to bottom.
> I know/understand so many things. You (a Shia) says from (your) side view and I
> am from my view.
>
> You can call me anything. May ALLAH forgive you and bless you, dear.
>
> Still I say, I search the TRUTH and continue it.
>
> I do believe that GOD revealed the way (deen) to us (the mankind) and it is one
> in the name ISLAM (in Arabic).
>
> I do further believe the deen of Adam to the last human being should be ISLAM
> (variations may found in languages, geographical and environmental changes,
> differences etc.). I will not add shia- or sunni or anything-else with ISLAM.
> To me there is no shia islam or sunni islam, as you claim as a shia muslim. I
> am a Muslim and not following any cult, including Ismaili or Aga Khani or shia
> or sunni! Is it clear, Madam?
>
> Now come to me and speak with me.
>
> While ALLAH says :akmalthu lakum deenakum......PERIOD. Do not add anything
> later.............later Politics and History should be dealt as it deserves and
> do not mix with ISLAMic Essence.
>
> Regards
>
> Prathiba
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Zina Khan <zina.khan@...>
>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 3, 2012 10:42 PM
> Subject: Prathiba-Sundari of Kerala slums : when you had enough, let me know
> bitch !
>
> Bilal did once paraphrase Allah’s words and say:
>
> "It is God, not man, who decides who will believe in Him."
>
> I have gauged the authenticity of Sunni Islam by its size. "
> All those 7O% of the total Muslim population have
> been misled or are dumb" .
>
> I went by the criterion:
> and remembered that according to statistics those who do not use 8O% of their
> brains are also in majority.. and so all the FOOLS are on one side !
>
>
> Intensive soul-searching and extensive research, will lead you to real Islam
> ..and you will renounce the Sunni cult ...you are not fluid...you are
> puzzled...confused...irrational and flying in all directions like some scattered
> locusts.....with numerous fiefdoms within your cult....you are conflictual and
> and at cross roads....the word "division" is not quite so accurate a term.
> Immediately, upon the Prophet's demise, there arose a splinter group that chose
> to break away from the mainstream and called itself "Sunni"- a term to
>
> identify themselves with...
>
> The following are some of the numerous predictions the Prophet is reported to
> have made regarding "divisions" in Islam in the wake of his death:
>
> -"You will, after my death, revert to the habits of your precursors."
> (Mishkat)..and so most of you are until today medieval and Jahils...
>
>
> -"There will be rulers (among you) who will not follow my ways of teaching.
> (Mishkat)....that is your cult baby !
>
>
> -"Calamities will fall on your houses, after me, like rain falls."
> (Mishkat, Muslim, Bukhari)....seems like you are blind and dumb...most of you
> are embroiled in turbulence and turmoil....bombs (stones) are falling over
> your kufr heads....and you cannot still understand..lol ! how stupid can one
> be?
>
>
> -"Prejudice and killing will increase in my Umma, after me." (Mishkat,
> Bukhari, Muslim)....that is why you kill and maim and call it "Jihad" to mislead
> the world...
>
>
> -"Your leaders will lead you astray, and the sword will be drawn and the
> bloodshed will not stop in my Umma, till the Last Day." (Mishkat, Daood,
> Tirmidhi)
>
>
> You totally deserve it !
>
> You betrayed Muhamad and his family and consequently Allah and have made a
> complete mockery of islam !
>
>
> -"Intrigue will start from my mosque (in Medina)." (Al-Belaghul Mobin)
>
> -"Immediately after me, there will be rulers who will lead you to kufr and
> if you will refuse to follow them, they will kill you." (Al-Belaghul Mobin, p.
> 43)
>
>
> Now you should know who is the Kufr ?
>
> -"Monkeys will jump on my mimber (pulpit) in the mosque." The Holy Prophet
> was shown a vision about this. (See Quran Ch. 17 v. 6O).
>
>
> The Omayyad rulers are referred to as monkeys by the Prophet and as the
> "Accursed Tree" in the Holy Quran.
>
>
> And so what would be the quaility of the TEXTS
> and Narrations, be like, whether you name it this or that?
>
> -"In the near future, you will see that ignorance will spread, spiritual
> knowledge will disappear and "haraj" will prevail." When asked, what "haraj"
> was, the Prophet said: "killing." (Al-Belaghul Mobin, p. 43)
>
>
> Your ignorance is clearly known and visible to the world !
>
> -"At the Kauther, some persons will come to see me but they will be
> repulsed. I will say, "O Allah, they are my companions. Allah will reply: "You
> do not know how they had made mockery of the religion (Islam) after you." I
> will then shout, "Go away." (Al-belaghul Mobin, p. 46)
>
>
> Reader is advised to read "Tarikhe Tabari" Volume 4, in the chapter "Events from
> 4O to 132 A.H."
>
>
> This is an account of the way the Omayyad rulers bought the iman of the Muslim
> subjects. Tabari, by the way, is a well-known Suni hadith reporter.
>
>
>
> The Prophet's Islam was Shia Islam as was Abraham's Islam, Moses’ Islam,
> and Jesus’ Islam. Abraham has been called a Shia -a friend of God - in the
> Quran.
>
>
> So Shia Islam is not just 14OO years old.
>
> The need to publicly use this label of "Shia" arose only when the self-seeking
> group (SUNNIS) decided to break away from the Shia main stream.
>
>
> Consequently, there arose a need to distinguish the Islam of the Prophet from
> that of the dissidents.
>
>
> Hence, the use of the labels "Shia" and "Sunni".
>
> We can conclude that the application of the word "Shia" is at least as old as
> Abraham himself -about 5OOO years - while that of "Suni" is only about 14OO
> years old.
>
>
> And, since we accept all the prophets before Abraham as Allah's friends, they
> can all be called "Shias".
>
>
> Besides, the word "Shia" has its origin in the Quran, so it is part of divine
> revelation while the word "Suni" is not.
>
>
> 14OO years ago, the Quran enjoined on the believers to make their will and
> testament during their lifetime.
>
>
> And yet, here it is alleged by the SUNNIS that the Prophet himself was guilty of
> failing to abide by the Quranic injunction.
>
>
> It would baffle any sane mind to think that the Prophet, who had toiled to
> transform the Arab nation from its barbaric state to a civilized one, would
> leave it unattended and uncared-for upon his demise.
>
>
> While even the head of an average household does worry about his loved ones
> and takes care to make known how he wants his affairs to be managed in his
> absence should he become deceased, this great Prophet of Allah, who preached
> making of a will mandatory, allegedly did not worry about the future of his
> beloved Muslim Umma (community) and gravely neglected to practice what he
> himself preached: He himself allegedly omitted to make a will. How absurd,
> indeed!
>
>
> When on his death bed, the Prophet wished to have his designation of Ali as
> his successor to be committed to writing and for this reason he asked for paper
> and pen several times, but those such as Omar and Abu-Bakkar kept ignoring him
> for they very well knew why the Prophet was repeatedly asking for pen and
> paper.
>
>
> The two also asked others who were present to ignore the Prophet who, they said,
> was delirious and not of sound mind anymore.
>
>
> Omar never wanted Hazrat Ali to succeed the Prophet, Divine will or not. In his
> statement to Abdulla ibn Abbass, Omar said:
>
> "Indeed, the holy Prophet was never clear about the succession of Ali;
> but, at times, he exaggerated in praising Ali publicly so much so that we felt
> that the Holy Prophet was going away from truth. It is also true that I
> prevented the Holy Prophet before his death from writing a will in favor of
> Ali. I did it for the sake of Islam. By God of Kaba the Quraish would have
> never accepted Ali as their ruler. Had Ali become the Caliph, the people of
> Arabia would have revolted against him. The Holy Prophet understood my
> intention and therefore he kept quiet."
>
>
> (and so now they created another off shoot of Islam..and drifted away from the
> Islam of Muhamad !)
>
>
> Omar would openly disobey the Prophet. A year before the conquest of Mecca,
> Omar was asked by the Prophet to go on a mission to Mecca.
>
>
> Omar refused to go amid enemies without security.
>
> Islam is submission to the will of Allah. Allah received our submission through
> the Prophet.
>
>
> And here, we see the Prophet's companion and future Caliph disobeying Allah and
> his Prophet.
>
>
> There are several examples of Omar's disobedience, and also of Othman’s.
>
> History records that every single pilgrim, at Ghadir-al-Khum, pledged
> fealty and allegiance to Ali upon his declaration as Prophet's successor. Even
> those, who were inwardly hostile to Ali for his great attributes and his
> exalted position with the Prophet, hypocritically, came forward to congratulate
> him on his appointment and to take an oath of allegiance to him.
>
>
> The first and foremost to take the oath were Omar and Abu-Bakar, the first two
> Khalifs.
>
>
> Al-Ghazali, a Sunni Muslim, widely known and highly respected for his writings,
> has testified as true the event of Gadir-al-Khum.
>
>
> Soon after the above event, the Prophet passed away. While Ali was occupied
> with the Prophet's funeral rites, the Prophet's youngest wife Ayesha procured
> the election of her own father, Abu Bakr .
>
>
> Thus came into existence the SUNNI temporal power a faction that came to be
> known as "Sunnis".
>
>
> Those true to their pledge to Ali stayed steadfast and came to be publicly known
> as "Shias".
>
>
> Funeral rites over, Ali became abreast of the new developments. In the interest
> of national unity, Ali chose to refrain from pressing his claim to temporal
> authority although he had inherited both, the temporal and spiritual authority
> the SUNNIS usurped this...now they are thus the "pious ones"...
>
>
> Ali, In his wisdom knew that, pressing his claim would mean a national
> disaster, civil strife, and reversion to the anarchy of the pre-Islamic
> period....and the Prophet's islam would have become destroyed but for the
> wisdom of Ali in handling this situation..
>
>
> It would mean hardship, destitution and disease for his
> now prosperous nation.
>
> It would mean working against the cause of Islam rather
> than for it. It would mean undoing all that the Prophet had
> done and lived for...Sunnism is not part of Prophet's Ummat !
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
------------------------------------
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